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"ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)" (adabofoppo)
10/28/2016 at 11:26 • Filed to: Lowered Suspension, GTI, Ask Oppo

I want to improve the handling on my GTI. I asked about rear sway bars, and the vocal consensus was that I should look at my suspension first. I already have lighter wheels and better tires for summer.

So I took a look at it, and I think it needs improvement. I am ONLY after handling improvements, and not trying to drop my car like the typical VW crowd seems to do. I really do not want the car to be much lower than a stock Golf R, so I am not looking for a huge drop in ride height.

I also do not want to impact ride quality much, if at all.

Changing a car’s suspension is always a compromise, but I am looking to keep this daily driveable and not a racecar.

Am I better off with springs and dampers, or should I go for a full coil-over kit? If I go coil-overs, I will probably have them set to max height as I am not looking for insane lowering and just want better handling.

Or should I leave it alone and just learn how to drive better?

DISCUSSION (38)

S65 > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 11:28

will Golf-R parts fit on it?

Leon711 > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 11:30

could you get better tires?

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > S65
10/28/2016 at 11:33

I think the Golf R has a slightly different set up and those parts are not interchangeable.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > Leon711
10/28/2016 at 11:33

Already have lighter wheels and summer tires.

bradleyjames518 > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 11:34

I have a MKV, I would suggest H&R Sport or Cup springs and Bilstien struts/shocks to start. Then go to the swaybars. I actually have TT-RS swaybars and mounts in mine and it’s fantastic. The sport springs dropped by 2-3in and has a very nice ride height with perfect wheel gap.

RyanFrew > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 11:36

If you’re looking to improve handling, I’d start with better tires. Next, I don’t see what’s so wrong with a new rear sway bar, unless the VW crowd says that yours is already good. It can have a huge impact on reducing understeer for a small cost and minimum work. Make sure you’re including adjustable endlinks in there as well. Next, time to look at camber plates and coilovers. If you’re going to get cheap coilovers, just get something like Koni Yellows with good springs instead. After that, it might be fun to change the wheels and front sway bar. Finally, you can throw poly bushings throughout and swap the motor mounts, but I doubt you want to do that since you’re not looking for too much harshness.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > bradleyjames518
10/28/2016 at 11:36

How does it ride though? I will not deal with racecar-hard suspension. I very much like hot the GTI rides stock and want to stay as close to that as possible.

adamftw > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 11:36

Don’t get coil overs unless you get Bilstein PSS9s. My buddy had Bilstein struts and H&R sport springs and H&R sways on his MK6 TDI and it was a great improvement.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > RyanFrew
10/28/2016 at 11:41

I already have lighter wheels and summer tires.

The verdict was to wait and do the RSB last, as it will not have as much impact as changing the suspension overall. I am going to do one eventually as the GTI ‘pushes’ far too much and I want a more neutral rotation into corners.

DC3 LS, will be perpetually replacing cars until the end of time > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 11:47

I’d do the rear bar first. Will hardly change ride comfort and will definitely cause more rotation. Plus much cheaper than springs and shocks.

Leon711 > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 11:48

hmm.. if OEM is what you are after, why not see if you can obtain suspension from the GTI Clubsport? or maybe a good quality set of coilovers, KW or Weitec would be my choice, but then again I’m in Europe so it’s easier for me to get.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > Leon711
10/28/2016 at 11:50

KWs are ~$1,600+ over here. I can afford to get them, eventually. But I worry they will be too low.

vicali > bradleyjames518
10/28/2016 at 11:52

Agree, way back when I had h20 vws the HR sport kit was a perfect ‘starter’ set. I added that and a RSB an had a daily that could do anything with a smile. Added the cup kit to the summer car and it was to low to really enjoy year round.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > DC3 LS, will be perpetually replacing cars until the end of time
10/28/2016 at 11:53

That’s what I was thinking, but when I asked about the RSB before, several people suggested it is better to be done last.

Cost isn’t the issue -I’m not made of money so that isn’t bragging; if it is worth doing correctly, then I will wait and do it correctly when I can afford it. So, yes the suspension is more expensive than simply changing the RSB, but if that is what needs done first, then I will do it that when I have the funds.

Needmoargarage > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:02

A coil-over kit is just springs and dampers packaged together that are often ride height adjustable. A lot of them are junk for handling mostly aimed at those that think a stiffer ride means better grip. If you want a daily driver that corners a bit better, I would really go after springs, dampers, and bumpstops if applicable.

Changing a sway bar using stock suspension is a recipe for a really crappy handling car. It may corner ‘flatter’ but it will likely understeer/oversteer off the road far easier than even stock suspension. Generally you mess with springs, dampers, wheels, and tires until you get the response you like and then size appropriate sway bars.

bradleyjames518 > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:02

Go with H&R Sports. They are slightly stiffer than stock and are more progressive in the sense that they get stiffer as you compress them more. They ride nicely on the highway etc but you can feel you have stiff springs if you hit a big pothole at speed. I don’t mind the ride and daily drive it without any adverse affects.

RyanFrew > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:03

Yeah, I went back and looked at what AtlasM said. He nailed it. If you’re only going to do one thing, RSB for the win. If you’re going to do more, then wait for it. The short answer to your question then:

Good Coilovers > Good Springs & Dampers > Cheap Coilovers

nafsucof > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:05

I put konis on my stock springs in my st and it’s great. Much improved handling, later added the rsb to increase the rear spring rate that added better mid corner poise. I left the stock springs and with the konis set on full soft on road trips it rides better than stock but I can crank it up to firm things for track and Autocross. Maintained stock ride height. I’m itching for more spring rate now as I’ve gotten more competitive in autocross.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > Needmoargarage
10/28/2016 at 12:14

Yes, I am aware of what a coil-over is. And I also know to avoid cheap ones as, as you correctly observed, they are just for people wanting low above all else. That is why I am asking, as I want avoid making my car handle and ride like garbage.

I am seeing a lot of other people recommend springs and dampers first then tidy up with an RSB after.

LimitedTimeOnly @ opposite-lock.com > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:19

I’d like to think that the Dynamic Chassis Control (DCC) suspension is the best of all worlds, but I could be biased. Since you are looking at altering the suspension, I guess that you didn’t get this option.

I know that for me driving around, the stock height is already pretty low for some driveways, and I wouldn’t want to get lower. I would also think that getting a compliant ride but with better cornering will be difficult, and will be very interested to hear what you decide to do. Good luck!

ToyotaFamily > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:21

don’t know if they’re available for the mk7, but VWR had some decent springs for the mk6/5. dropped them less than half an inch (i think), but provided a noticeable change in driving, especially when paired with new shocks and RSB.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > LimitedTimeOnly @ opposite-lock.com
10/28/2016 at 12:26

Sadly, no DCC. I basically stole my car so I can’t really complain.

The GTI is already fairly low, so I am wary of making it impossible to live with. That is why I was asking about different setups. It sounds like a matched set of springs/dampers will give me what I am looking for without too much compromise.

Textured Soy Protein > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:37

Shocks & springs, if you get something not too aggressive, will hurt your ride the least. For what you’re describing I’d do Eibach Pro-Kit springs and Koni FSD shocks. You’ll get about a 1" drop and the ride will be firmer but not punishing.

arl > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 12:56

There are a lot of spring choices for GTI’s. I’ve been looking at what people are using and it seems that the popular choices are; Neuspeed, VWR, Emmanuel Design, Driver Gear, H&R, and Eibach. Then there’s shock choices; stock, Koni FSD, Koni yellow’s, and Bilstein’s as the most popular. That’s not even coilovers!

I’m looking at getting GTI and I’d like a bit of a drop, but nothing crazy and similar ride (but not harsh or bumpy).

The following seem like popular combos (man, I wish there was a way to test drive all these).

ED + stock shocks

VWR + Koni yellows

Neuspeed + FSD

Let us know what you end up with.

Matsayz > S65
10/28/2016 at 14:17

VW did the dick thing and didn’t make stuff easily interchangeable like Subaru’s.

DC3 LS, will be perpetually replacing cars until the end of time > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 14:18

It may be different with golfs, but I’ve never heard anything about needing to do spring/coil overs before roll bars. I think what they might be saying is if you’re going to do the springs eventually, just do them first and get a bar that works with them. Versus getting the bar then it being to big when you put coilovers on.

If you’re not trying to do anything, but make it rotate better. I’d just do the rear bar. It makes the biggest difference for an understeering FWD car. Because even with coilovers, many manufactures design them to keep the same handling balance (understeer/oversteer). So I’d still say go for the bar first.

Matsayz > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 14:18

Go talk to some of your local tuners or see if someone in the local VW club has the setup you’re looking for and ride with them. Almost everything is going to ruin the ride quality besides nicer tires which you already have.

wiffleballtony > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 14:29

http://www.ground-control-store.com/products/index.php

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > wiffleballtony
10/28/2016 at 16:39

All they have to offer are camber plates. I don’t need /\ angles like that.

wiffleballtony > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 17:45

I bought a set from them, came with camber plates pre installed.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > wiffleballtony
10/28/2016 at 18:21

A set of what? They do not offer springs, dampers, or coil-overs for my car. Only camber plates, which I won’t need.

They make good stuff, but it’s more than I am looking for and more expensive than I want to pay for.

wiffleballtony > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/28/2016 at 18:38

I did a search for VW, and it seems they have springs and such. Maybe the wrong year as I don’t know model years of Golf just by sight. I apologize if that’s the case.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > wiffleballtony
10/28/2016 at 19:28

I have the newest generation, so only camber plates for mine. I suspect they will eventually have more for the Mk 7 Golf/GTI.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > Textured Soy Protein
10/29/2016 at 12:32

Why that specific setup as opposed to the VWR springs and stock dampers/OEM+ dampers like Koni (Yellows?) etc?

Textured Soy Protein > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/29/2016 at 13:35

Koni FSD are softer than yellow. I dunno what VWR springs are, I’m assuming some VW specific thing and frankly I’m not a VW guy so don’t know about them. Lowering springs on stock shocks can sometimes ride worse than on performance shocks if the stock ones don’t have enough damping for the stiffer springs.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > Textured Soy Protein
10/29/2016 at 13:44

VWR is VW Racing, but they are not actually made by VW. They are made by RacingLine Performance. They are claimed to be designed specifically to work with the stock dampers. I am still researching all of this as well, but the VWR springs are the general go-to springs for people who want slightly lowered cars without much change in ride quality.

Why Eibach and not H&R or X-brand? Are the FSD still stiffer than stock dampers? I know all this is a compromise, but I still want the car to handle better than stock, so I am not sure why I would want softer dampers than stock; if that is indeed the case.

Textured Soy Protein > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable)
10/30/2016 at 13:11

Generally speaking, the less aggressive lowering springs will work ok with stock shocks but it really depends on the car how well they work.

On my old Mazdaspeed 6, I had AutoExe lowering springs (they’re a JDM Mazda-specific brand, kinda similar to what you’re describing with these VWRs) on stock shocks. It worked alright but was a little bit crashy.

On my 335xi, I have B&G S2 springs and Koni FSD shocks. I also have other things that stiffen up the ride like bushings, shock mounts, etc. It’s a firm ride, but it’s also nicely damped. I just hate potholes because of my 19" wheels with skinny-ass tires.

Anyway, of your typical aftermarket lowering springs, not talking about specific to certain cars, from softest/least drop to stiffest/most drop, it goes:

H&R OE Sport
Eibach Pro-Kit
B&G S2
H&R Sport
H&R Super Sport
Eibach Sportline
H&R Race

Not all of these are available for every car and this is not exactly the same for every car, but generally speaking this is how it goes.

bob and john > Matsayz
11/10/2016 at 12:12

its not so much dick thing as FWD VS AWD.